Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

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Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby Micromil » Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:38 pm

To anyone who has not yet seen
Mr. Ben Jammin has put up a document about some possible ideas to improve game play.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lTM ... edit?pli=1

Overall I think that there are some great things.
Firstly.
Protected Capitals - Awesome.
Thoughts though - make it so people can visit but if not in the nation are set to safe zone settings so they can not shoot, or add/remove bricks. I would even say can't access ships (like protected ships in spawn) that they have not brought in. They could however use trading / shop blocks.
Then it can be a gallery of the wonderful creations.
Visitors can only access through the main gate.
This could then make for a trading nation to have a trading hub that is safe for all yet.

As for system claims.
This could still be useful if you made it that nation gates can be created, in limited numbers, but only used in claimed systems. Then you can pop in and out of your claimed systems and be closer to your needed resource. They still need to be protected. But gates can only be placed in systems that are connected to the main one or have enough systems grouped together.
Others can still overcome your defences to claim a high resource system.
The fast travel thing may be an issue, but I am sure that it could be overcome... will think about it.
Maybe fast travel could be the drive for claiming - group several adjacent systems and harness their power - you can put a fast travel gate up. More systems the further it can be from the home system?
OR
Possibly more claimed territory allows for a bigger capital, lose the territory and you can't add more to the capital. Maybe it could become an intangible outline, but with chests and storage this would be a problem.
OR

The permanent structures - maybe the ancients left power generators that you can harness through your gate to power something special in your city - speed up ship production, more efficient ship production, make all nation ships faster or something, power fancy light shows.

Turtling prevention
- scripted events - great idea - capture the ship.
rewards? beside resources
-fancy flag/block to display at the capital in a "trophy room"
-custom items for wearing

Maybe some type of bounty system that players can get some sort of rating for PvP activities.
Also making it that resources for the ship-printing are different can print the ship if the base raw materials are correct.
So need iron or iron ore to "print" the iron parts of the ship, not just dirt - then they will have to go and search out, claim and protect those resources still.

These are my first thoughts, by no means infallible or well thought out, but just excited ramblings.
Hopefully will spark some other brilliant ideas.
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby Maeglin » Sat Nov 29, 2014 9:56 am

I was going to start a post about this but though I will just take over yours. :P

I agree with the idea of having non nation members visit the protected capital but not be able to interact with it.
Gotta show off ya stuff that you spend hours building. I have seen some great creativity.

I have read the ramshackle steam forum thread also. http://steamcommunity.com/app/310760/di ... 652003493/
He has some good points about escape drives.
Maybe they could be integrated into the core - so that only one is active at a time, and the original builder is the one who puts it on.
However it would need to be able to "lock" the doors of a ship, so someone would have to break in. It would be good if a locked ship could only be damaged by weapons if not on the
Or maybe the drive is what is locked to the ship unless it is unlocked with the code. No other escape drive will be able to be placed once the original one has been locked. If that makes sense?

Every choice creates more issues... the reason game development is such a long process I guess.

If spawn on ship is reinstated - needs to be totally changed (as Ben Said) timers or something.
But they were pretty buggy when ships were moving.
Pity you couldn't reverse the escape drive and make it that you teleport to the spawn chamber with a code - but then you still have the travelling ship problem and the problem of fast travel exploits issues.
Maybe re-spawns just drop you near, above and in front, of the ship and you need to use your jet pack to fine tune it (auto refill on death?). That could help as it would still allow you to come back but it would make a skill to re-spawning, and also it would slow the process of re-spawning without timers.
Otherwise implement harpoon guns and you need to harpoon the ship and be tethered before it runs away the pull yourself in.
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby MrBenjammin » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:46 pm

Hey guys, glad you read it through and agree with the ideas for the most part.

I agree that friendlies should be able to visit capitals. But it's something that would be added after the things in this proposal most likely as there's a lot of things to think about how they enter/leave, mechanical exploits and contextually how that works.

With the planned nerf to defenses to make them a bit more fluid for claims I'm not sure player created gates will be that viable. The problem being they'll be knocked out so often it would fast become a chore to rebuild them. The other issue being using them to fast travel by creating/destroying them at different locations.

The territory added space within the capital is a pretty interesting idea. The flip side is that obviously when you lose that space, it would just stop you from building more without deleting it as that'd be unfair. So you'd end up with players capping a tonne of areas. Filling all the space with blocks then not bothering to cap place for space expansion again if that makes sense. If it were to just stop building completely if you fall below the territory space cap it becomes very anti-intuitive for the player to be stopped from building stuff.

Making ships printable only if the raw materials are correct basically makes it really really cumbersome to ever print ships. I built this originally for manufacturing ships and it definitely much to awkward for anyone to use. Ship manufacture mainly exists to make ships much more riskable as the materials don't matter so much as the time you took to design and build it. Which is negated nicely when you can manufacture them. I think I'm going to push the prices up so ships cost 125% of their material costs making it much less viable to convert solid blocks. It's not necessarily bad that people manufacture blocks of materials as it does reduce some grind. But it should be mitigated a bit.
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby reape5r » Tue Dec 02, 2014 12:29 am

everyone agrees these ideas are fantastic, but im curious will it take a while to implement it to the game? seeing as its a large differance to what is currently used.
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby MrBenjammin » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:40 am

For all the stuff in the document, it's gonna take a little while to build it all into the game, especially since it likely won't be the only thing in updates. I'm hoping to get Capitals and Capital Gates into the next update. But we'll see how we go. Some of the ideas implementations work counter clockwise to how some of the game is built internally. So some rejiggering may be needed!
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby reape5r » Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:35 pm

thats ace and i like many others want the capital idea seeing as anything thats built is removed when we are offline and we dont have a chance to defned or build up enough force to stop certain players taking everything over and over. have you thought about turrets on the gates themselves to protect them from people trying to camp a persons capital gate, just an idea
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby reape5r » Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:42 pm

also will nations cost to start up like 50,000 coins or to build a capital gate cost resources before you can make a capital, how will making a capital and gates work
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby MrBenjammin » Tue Dec 02, 2014 4:41 pm

Like I stated above and as one of the options in the document. Players likely won't make gates as it's too problematic. You'll be able to assign a gate to your Capital that exists already on the map. There probably won't be costs associated as ideally you want players to have a safe spot ASAP.
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby reape5r » Tue Dec 02, 2014 7:09 pm

well its a very very neat idea be looking forward to been creative haha so will many others
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Re: Thoughts about MrB's proposed improvements

Postby Sssuperguy » Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:31 am

I think I want to expand on the ship manufacturing exploits a little more. In my own nation, I scanned a 4x4x5 block of titanium and the same with steel as ships, and manufactured out of dirt and other useless things. What this does is it removes the uniqueness of having different biomes; someone in a sand biome would have access to titanium and metals by mining sand, dirt, etc. and in the future, people won't need to stray far from their capitals to gain resources.

What you could do is get the ship manufacturer to accept items only usable by it. For example, you could make something like metal sheeting-- recipes could be 1 from copper, 2 from iron, etc...
A metal block would then require this.
If this was done, you could require only a few types of things to make ships:
-Metal sheeting (made from metals, or perhaps ores) for metal blocks
-Molten glass (made from sand) for glass
-Power cells (made from burnt out cores)
-Basic machines (made from copper)
-Quality machines (made from iron/steel)
-Advanced machines (made from titanium)

That's just an example, of course. If each ship item took a combination of these objects to create, ships could still be made conveniently while eliminating some of the exploits. No more titanium made out of grass!
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